| Pages in topic: [1 2] > | Critique your own test translation..? Thread poster: Iris Shalev
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Iris Shalev 
Israel
Local time: 22:20
English to Dutch
+ ...
Hi all,
I've encountered a small situation, that I would like to discuss with some fellow freelancers...
A translation agency that I work for a lot asked me last week to do a translation of about 500 words for a relatively new client. Another translator had done their translations before (I had proofread some of those, so I knew), but was now not answering and this piece was kind of urgent.
I agreed, did the translation, reviewed the proofreading when I go... See more Hi all,
I've encountered a small situation, that I would like to discuss with some fellow freelancers...
A translation agency that I work for a lot asked me last week to do a translation of about 500 words for a relatively new client. Another translator had done their translations before (I had proofread some of those, so I knew), but was now not answering and this piece was kind of urgent.
I agreed, did the translation, reviewed the proofreading when I got it back and then sent it off. Nothing was heard again, until yesterday evening, when I suddenly got a message saying: "The client has reviewed your test translation and made some changes. Could you just check the changes, fill in the attached form, incorporate the changes in the text and send it back to us."
I was kind of surprised. This turned to horror when I opened the file: it was like a bloodbath. Absolutely everything had been slashed and completely transformed. Not a single sentence was allowed to stay unchanged.
Not only that, but the form I was supposed to fill in went something like this:
Source sentence - Original translation - Corrected translation - Severity of errors - Explanation.
I was supposed to analyse their revision of my translation, give my own errors a rating of mild to severe and explain why this was.
I was stunned and offended. I am used to having people criticise my work and usually I try to view this objectively and not take it personally. But this was just too much. Besides, I was looking at hours of work here (unpaid, of course) which I was supposed to do that same evening.
I wrote back and said I didn't have time for it.
They came back today and told me 'we understand it's a lot of work, but we need you to do this.'
I refused. I couldn't do it. Not only was I busy with other work, but I thought it was extremely unfair to ask this of me.
I hadn't been told it was a test translation, I was asked at the last moment to fill in for someone else, whose style I was trying to respect by leaving TM matches mostly intact, and now I'm the one who is expected to do hours of extra unpaid work critiquing her own translation...
I haven't got an answer yet. I hope very much this hasn't damaged my relationship with the agency, but I don't know...
I'm wondering what you would have done? Do you think I did the right thing, or did I take this too personally?
Thanks for any replies,
Iris. ▲ Collapse
| | | | Robert Forstag
United States
Local time: 15:20
Spanish to English
+ ...
| I would have been firmer still | May 18, 2016 |
I think you did the right thing. I myself would have been more forthright, along the following lines:
Dear X,
When you assigned, and I accepted, this small job on [insert date], you did not inform me that the extensive follow-up you are now requesting would be part of the project. Said follow-up therefore constitutes *new work* outside the bounds of our original agreement - work that would take a good deal more time for me to complete than the original assignment itself... See more I think you did the right thing. I myself would have been more forthright, along the following lines:
Dear X,
When you assigned, and I accepted, this small job on [insert date], you did not inform me that the extensive follow-up you are now requesting would be part of the project. Said follow-up therefore constitutes *new work* outside the bounds of our original agreement - work that would take a good deal more time for me to complete than the original assignment itself.
My charge for the additional work would be $XXX, with a deadline of [insert comfortable deadline date]. Please send me a new or amended PO for this new phase of the project.
In the meantime, attached is my invoice for the completed assignment, with balance due on [date].
Kind regards,
Iris Shalev
*******
If they gave me more grief, i would stand firm and threaten to report their unethical practice to all appropriate forums.
!בהצלחה
[Edited at 2016-05-18 13:11 GMT] ▲ Collapse
| | | | | How ghastly! | May 18, 2016 |
Alas, poor Iris!
Politely inform this agency that you are at present working on paid orders from other clients and that you will complete the task on (date) in exchange for your usual hourly fee according to a purchase order which the agency will, of course, send you.
Best of luck!
| | | | Iris Shalev
Israel
Local time: 22:20
English to Dutch
+ ...
TOPIC STARTER
Thank you, Robert! That certainly put my mind at rest
I suppose many of us are always hesitant to say 'no', because we are afraid of losing customers. I don't think I will lose this particular agency, though, because there are many PMs, I have worked with them for years and I have never had issues with anyone before.
Anyway, if that client hated my translation that badly, I would prefer not to work with t... See more Thank you, Robert! That certainly put my mind at rest
I suppose many of us are always hesitant to say 'no', because we are afraid of losing customers. I don't think I will lose this particular agency, though, because there are many PMs, I have worked with them for years and I have never had issues with anyone before.
Anyway, if that client hated my translation that badly, I would prefer not to work with them in future... so it is better for everyone if they just find someone else. ▲ Collapse
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Iris Shalev
Israel
Local time: 22:20
English to Dutch
+ ...
TOPIC STARTER | What about the analysing bit? | May 18, 2016 |
Well, it was of course also the non-paid bit that I objected to, but I was mainly wondering what you all thought about having to analyse your own translation... This was what really got to me. Any thoughts?
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This "homework" style of feedback has got to go. If "track changes" was used, I would suggest quickly going through and accepting or rejecting the changes. No explanation required.
| | | | Robert Forstag
United States
Local time: 15:20
Spanish to English
+ ...
| Strange and objectionable | May 18, 2016 |
Iris Shalev wrote:
Well, it was of course also the non-paid bit that I objected to, but I was mainly wondering what you all thought about having to analyse your own translation... This was what really got to me. Any thoughts?
I have been asked to review and respond to proofreader comments, but never to do the kind of *ex post facto* self-evaluation that you describe.
So I think it strange and objectionable, apart from the compensation issue.
[Edited at 2016-05-18 13:19 GMT]
| | | | Niina Lahokoski
Finland
Local time: 22:20
Member (2008)
English to Finnish
+ ...
| Very odd request | May 18, 2016 |
I have sometimes been asked to provide such analysis as part of a paid review of someone else's translation, and also received such analysis of my translation, done by a reviewer. I've also been asked to implement reviewer changes in my own translation, but then it's always been a case of a few touches here and there, nothing major. I certainly have never been asked to analyse my own translation in this way, and I don't see any point in it. It's a proofreader's/reviewer's job to rate the errors ... See more I have sometimes been asked to provide such analysis as part of a paid review of someone else's translation, and also received such analysis of my translation, done by a reviewer. I've also been asked to implement reviewer changes in my own translation, but then it's always been a case of a few touches here and there, nothing major. I certainly have never been asked to analyse my own translation in this way, and I don't see any point in it. It's a proofreader's/reviewer's job to rate the errors and justify their changes.
I would refuse politely. ▲ Collapse
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neilmac
Spain
Local time: 21:20
Spanish to English
+ ...
I probably wouldn't have accepted the test translation anyway, but if I had, I'd then have struggled to respond to their subsequent absurd request without telling them exactly what I thought of them, and to stick their odd demands"where the sun don't shine", but even more rudely. Life's too short.
| | | | Paula Darwish
United Kingdom
Local time: 20:20
Member (2013)
Turkish to English
+ ...
| self-appointed proofreaders | May 18, 2016 |
Many of the so-called proofreaders working for these agencies do not know what they are doing. Professional proofreaders expect good money - just like professional translators - and so some agencies cut corners by using unqualified self-appointed experts in the said language, many of whom change things just for the sake of it. A good proofreader analysing a good translation will not need to make many changes. I am happy to take constructive comments about my work but would never waste time going... See more Many of the so-called proofreaders working for these agencies do not know what they are doing. Professional proofreaders expect good money - just like professional translators - and so some agencies cut corners by using unqualified self-appointed experts in the said language, many of whom change things just for the sake of it. A good proofreader analysing a good translation will not need to make many changes. I am happy to take constructive comments about my work but would never waste time going through paragraphs of pedantic twaddle and inane comments from a proofreader who is a self-appointed language expert. ▲ Collapse
| | | | Iris Shalev
Israel
Local time: 22:20
English to Dutch
+ ...
TOPIC STARTER
... that you all think it was an unreasonable request, too. I was starting to doubt myself and think I was being too touchy.
When I was in uni, one of my translation teachers told us there should be a separate course called "kissing clients' ar**" I always think of that in these moments
[Edited at 2016-05-18 15:36 GMT]
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Paula D wrote:
Many of the so-called proofreaders working for these agencies do not know what they are doing. Professional proofreaders expect good money - just like professional translators - and so some agencies cut corners by using unqualified self-appointed experts in the said language, many of whom change things just for the sake of it. A good proofreader analysing a good translation will not need to make many changes. I am happy to take constructive comments about my work but would never waste time going through paragraphs of pedantic twaddle and inane comments from a proofreader who is a self-appointed language expert.
I once had a similar experience when an agency sent me back the proofreader's remarks for a short translation I did for them. Well, although the translation was still "OK" as far as the "overall score" was concerned, believe it or not, 3/4th of the "errors" (not "preferential changes") she reported were marked as something like "wrong use of standard industry terminology" for things such as prepositions, articles, ellipses(!), asterisks(!), etc.
No more...
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Robert Forstag wrote:
I think you did the right thing. I myself would have been more forthright, along the following lines:
Dear X,
When you assigned, and I accepted, this small job on [insert date], you did not inform me that the extensive follow-up you are now requesting would be part of the project. Said follow-up therefore constitutes *new work* outside the bounds of our original agreement - work that would take a good deal more time for me to complete than the original assignment itself.
My charge for the additional work would be $XXX, with a deadline of [insert comfortable deadline date]. Please send me a new or amended PO for this new phase of the project.
In the meantime, attached is my invoice for the completed assignment, with balance due on [date].
Kind regards,
Iris Shalev
*******
If they gave me more grief, i would stand firm and threaten to report their unethical practice to all appropriate forums.
!בהצלחה
[Edited at 2016-05-18 13:11 GMT]
I don't mind having a look at the ("so called?") corrections, we all make mistakes, so proper feedback is always welcome. I see it as a service to the client, but if it means doing the Battle of Waterloo all over again, I ask my hourly rate.
Robert, do you mind if I safe your example text? Might come in handy some day.
[Edited at 2016-05-18 16:14 GMT]
[Edited at 2016-05-18 16:20 GMT]
| | | | Kay Denney
France
Local time: 21:20
French to English
this often happened at the agency I worked at, clients would send stuff back with all sorts of "corrections".
most could be dismissed with a "this is a purely subjective change" or "if you think this is right, you really did need a professional" or "if you wanted specific terms why didn't you give us a glossary" or "well that's not what the source said, a translator is not allowed to add or subtract information" or "ha ha!". Since we were a high-class agency with great emphasis on q... See more this often happened at the agency I worked at, clients would send stuff back with all sorts of "corrections".
most could be dismissed with a "this is a purely subjective change" or "if you think this is right, you really did need a professional" or "if you wanted specific terms why didn't you give us a glossary" or "well that's not what the source said, a translator is not allowed to add or subtract information" or "ha ha!". Since we were a high-class agency with great emphasis on quality, we responded to every single remark. It took me hours to wade through some stuff, but then, I was on a salary.
at most I would admit to a comma improving the flow of a sentence and maybe a couple of terms that were slightly more common than what we had put, very rarely did anyone highlight any major issues.
we often concluded that it was simply an attempt to bump the price down a bit.
for my own peace of mind I would go through and check that I hadn't made any major booboos, and send back a short note specifying which of the categories listed above were applicable to the changes made. ▲ Collapse
| | | | Robert Forstag
United States
Local time: 15:20
Spanish to English
+ ...
Robert Rietvelt wrote: Robert, do you mind if I safe your example text? Might come in handy some day. [Edited at 2016-05-18 16:14 GMT] [Edited at 2016-05-18 16:20 GMT]
No problem! 😊
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