Glossary entry

English term or phrase:

whose

English answer:

antecedent can be animate or inanimate

Added to glossary by Martina Pokupec (X)
Jun 12, 2011 15:17
12 yrs ago
1 viewer *
English term

whose

English Other Linguistics grammar
Hi all you grammar enthusiasts. I need a confirmation that "whose" is still used for people only. I have seen some sentences on the web exemplifying the opposite; however, to me it sounds more natural to use "whose" for people and "of which" for everything else. Is there a difference in American and British English?
Thank you!

Discussion

Martina Pokupec (X) (asker) Jun 13, 2011:
thank you!! all! for your kind contribution :)
Michael Powers (PhD) Jun 12, 2011:
use of "whose" when antecedent is inaminate Search ResultsWhose for Inanimate Objects : Grammar Girl :: Quick and Dirty Tips ™ May 23, 2008 ... Get Grammar Girl's take on whose for inanimate objects. Learn whether you are allowed to use whose to refer to inanimate objects.
grammar.quickanddirtytips.com/whose-for-inanimate-objects.aspx - Cached - Similar►
José J. Martínez Jun 12, 2011:
The word is still used. Depends on the sentence or phrase but whose is mostlyused referring directly to the subject.

Responses

+14
4 mins
Selected

antecedent can be animate or inanimate

Wordsworth, Shakespeare, modern usage, etc.

Mike

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Note added at 8 mins (2011-06-12 15:26:10 GMT)
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Whose to Refer to Inanimate Objects
There is no dispute about using whose to refer to a person or animal. There is, however, some argument about whether it’s OK to use whose to refer to something that’s not a person or animal: a car or a tree, for instance. That’s what Mike was asking about: whether it’s OK to use whose to refer to what’s known as an “inanimate antecedent.” Cars and trees are not alive in the same sense as people and animals. Of course trees are living plants, but plants are considered inanimate. I guess they can’t talk or communicate in an animated fashion.

In short, Mike is perfectly right when he uses whose to refer to tree. Although some people don’t like it, whose is the only English word we have to refer to inanimate antecedents. Perhaps someone will invent a new word for this purpose, but as of now we’re stuck with whose. Going all the way back to the 14th century, you’ll find many literary examples of authors referring back to an inanimate antecedent (1). Fowler’s quotes Milton’s Paradise Lost: “Of man’s first disobedience, and the fruit Of that forbidden tree, whose mortal taste Brought death into the world…” (3).


First, for those of you who didn't listen all the way to the end of last week's show and were outraged that I used the words irregardless and cogitate; it was a joke; although apparently some of you didn't think it was very funny. It followed the section about depression and was meant to show that I was depressed. A depressed Grammar Girl uses poor grammar. Get it? If you had listened to the end or checked the website, you would have heard my note that it was a joke. Sorry for any confusion.
A listener named Mike Murphy wrote in with this message:
The car whose windshield wipers weren't working was driving in the fast lane. The tree whose leaves were falling seems to be dying. Whose seems like it must refer to a person or animal but not to a car or a tree, and it does not sound correct. Is it correct to use whose in this manner? And is there perhaps a better way to construct the above sentences?
Thanks for your question, Mike. If you used whose in those two sentences, you’d be in the same company as Shakespeare, Milton, and Wordsworth—all famous writers (1). You might, however, annoy a few modern complainers who think you should use whose to refer to people and animals only.


Whose Versus of Which
Some sticklers prefer you use whose to refer to animate antecedents only, but Fowler’s refers to this preference as a “folk-belief” (3). Fowler himself wrote in 1926, “Let us, in the name of common sense, prohibit the prohibition of ‘whose’ inanimate; good writing is surely difficult enough without the forbidding of things that have historical grammar, and present intelligibility, and obvious convenience, on their side….” These folk-believers think you should substitute the phrase of which for whose. I’ve been trying to reword that Milton quotation by using of which, but I can’t manage to create a palatable sentence. I’m having the same trouble rewording both of Mike’s examples: “The car whose windshield wipers…” and “The tree whose leaves…”

In some cases, you might be able to use of which, but most of the time your sentence will sound stilted and your sentence flow will be ruined. The three major sources I referred to all agree that of which is not an ideal solution to the whose conundrum (1, 2, 3). The American Heritage Guide to Contemporary Usage and Style states, “This is one case in which the cure could be worse than the disease.” Funny how it didn’t state it this way: “This is one case whose cure could be worse than the disease.”
Should You Avoid Using Whose?
Sometimes, the best way to deal with this problem is to reword the sentence to avoid whose altogether. Let’s try this out on one of Mike’s sentences: “The car whose windshield wipers weren't working was driving in the fast lane.” You could rewrite this in a number of ways, but I like “Although the car’s windshield wipers weren’t working, it was driving in the fast lane.”



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Note added at 1 hr (2011-06-12 16:36:05 GMT)
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Everything I quoted is verbatim from the article I cited in refernces. But since that is not apprently clear, here is the reference in this part of the answer, too.

use of "whose" when antecedent is inaminate11:23

Search ResultsWhose for Inanimate Objects : Grammar Girl :: Quick and Dirty Tips ™ May 23, 2008 ... Get Grammar Girl's take on whose for inanimate objects. Learn whether you are allowed to use whose to refer to inanimate objects.
grammar.quickanddirtytips.com/whose-for-inanimate-objects.aspx - Cached
Peer comment(s):

agree Kim Metzger : But our British/Irish etc. colleagues may disagree.
1 min
Actually its use was extensive with inaminate antecedents in Great Britain long before the US ever existed (at least since the 14th century).
agree Charles Davis : This British colleague doesn't disagree: the idea that "whose" cannot have an inanimate antecedent is absurd. I suppose it is promoted by people who associate it with "who". Replacing "whose" with "of which" usually produces grotesque results.
30 mins
I hear you, Charles. It has been in use before the US ever existed, so its use is certainly supported by its etymology in British use. And, i believe your supposition is right that many people associate it with "who". I believe you are right on. Mike
agree Jim Tucker (X) : As relative, yes; as interrogative of course, only used with people. That might be part of the confusion.
39 mins
Thank you, Jim - Mike
agree Jack Doughty
53 mins
Thank you, Jack - Mike
agree Madeleine MacRae Klintebo : Although when copying text verbatim you really should give credit, for both legal and moral reasons, as Kim does in his reference comment below.
1 hr
Thank you, Madeleine. I actually posted the reference in the other section from which I copied all the text. I am sorry that was not clear.
agree Arabic & More
3 hrs
Thank you, Amel - Mike
agree Jenni Lukac (X)
3 hrs
Thank you, Jenni - Mike
agree Stephanie Ezrol : thanks for the extended discussion on the subject. It's useful and interesting.
4 hrs
Thank you, Stephanie - Mike
agree Jonas Teixeira (X) : An excellent contribution, yours and that of our peers! Nothing to add up.
4 hrs
Thank you, Jonas - Mike
agree eski : Just so, old chap! eski :))
4 hrs
Thank you, eski - "old" is better than the alternative! Mike
agree Cilian O'Tuama : My Irish ears don't take offence, or was that offense? I, whose ears are Irish, don't take any. Cheers!
8 hrs
Nor do mine, and with the last name "Powers" I obviously have Irish blood. Cheers!
agree Phong Le
21 hrs
Thank you, Phong Le - Mike
agree Lirka
23 hrs
Thank you, lirka - Mike
agree Yasutomo Kanazawa
1 day 1 hr
Thank you, Yasutomo - Mike
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4 KudoZ points awarded for this answer. Comment: "Thank you!"
15 mins

whose...inanimate possibly

whose

whose Adjective

whose Pronoun

whose move is it whose move is it Interjection
whose turn is it, whose play is it

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Reference comments

6 mins
Reference:

OK for American English

Whose to Refer to People and Animals
Whose is the possessive form of both who and which (2). It makes sense to say that whose is the possessive form of who because who is in the word. As you know, you use who to refer to a person or sometimes an animal, and this person or animal you’re referring to is called an “animate antecedent.” “Animate” refers to living people and animals (but not plants), such as my son, Jake, or his pet fish, Gary. An “antecedent” is a word that you’re referring back to. So in the sentence “Jake fed Gary, whose favorite food was dried worms,” “Gary” is the antecedent of whose.

Whose to Refer to Inanimate Objects
There is no dispute about using whose to refer to a person or animal. There is, however, some argument about whether it’s OK to use whose to refer to something that’s not a person or animal: a car or a tree, for instance. That’s what Mike was asking about: whether it’s OK to use whose to refer to what’s known as an “inanimate antecedent.” Cars and trees are not alive in the same sense as people and animals. Of course trees are living plants, but plants are considered inanimate. I guess they can’t talk or communicate in an animated fashion.

In short, Mike is perfectly right when he uses whose to refer to tree. Although some people don’t like it, whose is the only English word we have to refer to inanimate antecedents. Perhaps someone will invent a new word for this purpose, but as of now we’re stuck with whose. Going all the way back to the 14th century, you’ll find many literary examples of authors referring back to an inanimate antecedent (1). Fowler’s quotes Milton’s Paradise Lost: “Of man’s first disobedience, and the fruit Of that forbidden tree, whose mortal taste Brought death into the world…” (3).

http://grammar.quickanddirtytips.com/whose-for-inanimate-obj...
Peer comments on this reference comment:

agree Jim Tucker (X) : OK - but "who" is not really in "whose". Rather, both are derived from the same relative kw* (easy to see that Lat. "cuius" is cognate w/ "whose")
4 hrs
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42 mins
Reference:

OK for inanimate antecedents in British English too

My faith in Oxford English dictionaries is not unlimited, in theory, but they are usually reliable. Here is part of the online entry for "whose":

"relative Possessive determiner
of whom or which (used to indicate that the following noun belongs to or is associated with the person or thing mentioned in the previous clause): he's a man whose opinion I respect."
http://oxforddictionaries.com/definition/whose
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