Mar 24, 2013 18:54
11 yrs ago
French term
prend place
Non-PRO
French to English
Marketing
Tourism & Travel
Holiday rentals
This comes from publicity material for a studio flat on the top floor of a 14th century building which has been converted for holiday rentals.
"L'ensemble prend place sous une magnifique charpente du type "coque du bateau inversée".
I'm not sure how to translate "prend place" which I've never seen used like this before. So far I've come up with "the apartment occupies a space in a remarkable structure shaped like an upturned boat".
Has anyone an alternative to "occupies a space"?
"L'ensemble prend place sous une magnifique charpente du type "coque du bateau inversée".
I'm not sure how to translate "prend place" which I've never seen used like this before. So far I've come up with "the apartment occupies a space in a remarkable structure shaped like an upturned boat".
Has anyone an alternative to "occupies a space"?
Proposed translations
(English)
| 4 +4 | is set |
Emma Paulay
|
| 3 +4 | is located in |
Assia SANLIS
|
| 4 +2 | is situated |
Atelier de Mots
|
| 3 | extends/spreads out |
Wolf Draeger
|
| 5 -3 | resides |
papier
|
| 4 -3 | takes place |
Verginia Ophof
|
Change log
Mar 25, 2013 00:56: philgoddard changed "Level" from "PRO" to "Non-PRO"
Mar 25, 2013 11:43: writeaway changed "Field" from "Other" to "Marketing"
Votes to reclassify question as PRO/non-PRO:
PRO (1): Emma Paulay
Non-PRO (3): AllegroTrans, Yvonne Gallagher, philgoddard
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Proposed translations
+4
16 hrs
Selected
is set
I think you need the idea of "setting" here. Set beneath a magnificent ceiling with exposed beams shaped like an overturned hull. Or even "nestled beneath".
Note from asker:
| Thank you Emma. I like your suggested translation very much! |
Peer comment(s):
| agree |
AllegroTrans
: this sounds natural
32 mins
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Thank you.
|
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| agree |
Jane Proctor (X)
: yes, and I like your whole sentence
42 mins
|
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Thanks, Jane.
|
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| agree |
Wolf Draeger
1 hr
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Thanks, Wolf.
|
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| agree |
Sheila Wilson
3 hrs
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Thanks, Sheila.
|
4 KudoZ points awarded for this answer.
Comment: "Many thank Emma. Sorry that this was changed to a non-pro question by the site's self-appointed watchdogs!"
-3
2 mins
Verginia Ophof
Belize
Belize
Native in English
Specializes in field
Belize
Near Native Proficiency in Source langua
Native in: English
Works in: Portuguese to English, Dutch to English, French to English
Related KudoZ points
:
6
takes place
suggestion
Peer comment(s):
| disagree |
Atelier de Mots
: "takes place" is a literal translation, but does not address the meaning here.
6 mins
|
| disagree |
AllegroTrans
: it's not an event. so this does not work
6 mins
|
| disagree |
Jane Proctor (X)
: as above
17 hrs
|
+4
13 mins
is located in
je crois que c'est plus dans le sens se situe
Peer comment(s):
| agree |
sktrans
2 hrs
|
| agree |
Yvonne Gallagher
5 hrs
|
| agree |
philgoddard
5 hrs
|
| agree |
ACOZ (X)
8 hrs
|
+2
18 mins
is situated
I think this is the most natural way to express the meaning here.
NOTE: I am having technical difficulties. Je m'excuse. I posted this and accidentally clicked to HIDE THE ANSWER. I also thanked Allegro when I meant to thank Gail. Does anyone know how to UNHIDE an answer?
NOTE: I am having technical difficulties. Je m'excuse. I posted this and accidentally clicked to HIDE THE ANSWER. I also thanked Allegro when I meant to thank Gail. Does anyone know how to UNHIDE an answer?
Peer comment(s):
| agree |
gail desautels
: hmm no idea how to unhide...
2 mins
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Merci, Gail! Tough times when French is easier than technology.
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| agree |
Jean-Claude Gouin
36 mins
|
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Merci, Quebec!
|
|
| neutral |
philgoddard
: I don't see how this is different to Assia's answer.
5 hrs
|
16 hrs
extends/spreads out
Difficult to say whether the Fr is bad copy, overreaching or an example of unusual and creative use of language...my suggestion assumes the latter :-)
Much room for improvement, of course, but maybe this will spark other ideas.
Unfurls, unfolds?
Much room for improvement, of course, but maybe this will spark other ideas.
Unfurls, unfolds?
Example sentence:
The apartment extends under a magnificent structure in the shape of an upturned boat.
The apartment spreads out beneath a magnificent structure in the shape of an upturned boat.
Peer comment(s):
| neutral |
papier
: it is a smart use of the language, Wolf. And I think "extends" is the meaning as "resides" also is.
2 hrs
|
-3
3 hrs
resides
A suggestion:
"The unity resides under an upturned boat-like structure".
--------------------------------------------------
Note added at 19 horas (2013-03-25 14:41:36 GMT)
--------------------------------------------------
French use of "prend place" is a way of magnifying the unit (ensemble) to the readers and has an implicit "personification" of the verb, too.
--------------------------------------------------
Note added at 20 horas (2013-03-25 15:41:43 GMT)
--------------------------------------------------
Just remembering that to reside has a Latin route as follows:
"Late Middle English (in the sense 'be in residence as an official'): probably a back-formation from resident, influenced by French résider or Latin residere 'remain', from re- 'back' + sedere 'sit'"
Source: Oxford British English dictionary
Clearly the same sense of "to occupy".
--------------------------------------------------
Note added at 21 horas (2013-03-25 16:51:32 GMT)
--------------------------------------------------
Some uses of to reside:
The headquarters
"Neale Attenborough took over as CEO from Emrick after the sale. The Hillsboro label center was shut in 2007 with those crusades consolidated with a sister company's processes in Pennsylvania, while the headquarters RESIDED in Hillsboro with 150 employees."
http://www.amazines.com/Business/article_detail.cfm/3046887?...
Perfumes
"Marni is one of a few new perfumes to graduate from my workroom to my bedroom mantelpiece, where my personal-use scents RESIDE. Here are the others."
http://www.guardian.co.uk/fashion/2013/mar/23/sali-hughes-ne...
The newness
"This, though, is a crude summary of a wispy, shape-shifting book, for there are other worlds at play. The name Novilla captures the mixture of newness and nowhere that RESIDES in literary utopias from Thomas More onwards."
http://www.ft.com/intl/cms/s/2/151395ea-84e4-11e2-891d-00144...
Public spending:
"Apprenticeships are partly funded by a tax on corporations and while companies can channel part of their contribution to the schools they want to support, the bulk of the public spending allocation power RESIDES with local governments."
http://www.ft.com/cms/s/2/c575b508-6581-11e2-a3db-00144feab4...
Data:
"The business needs to be able to prevent the loss of data that may come to RESIDE on those devices."
http://www.guardian.co.uk/media-network/media-network-blog/2...
A trophy:
"Chelsea fans may forgive Roman Abramovich anything for as long as the Champions League trophy RESIDES at Stamford Bridge. "
http://www.guardian.co.uk/football/blog/2013/feb/28/rafael-b...
A statue:
"Where Should Statue Of Barnum RESIDE?"
http://www.nytimes.com/1993/12/26/nyregion/l-where-should-st...
"The unity resides under an upturned boat-like structure".
--------------------------------------------------
Note added at 19 horas (2013-03-25 14:41:36 GMT)
--------------------------------------------------
French use of "prend place" is a way of magnifying the unit (ensemble) to the readers and has an implicit "personification" of the verb, too.
--------------------------------------------------
Note added at 20 horas (2013-03-25 15:41:43 GMT)
--------------------------------------------------
Just remembering that to reside has a Latin route as follows:
"Late Middle English (in the sense 'be in residence as an official'): probably a back-formation from resident, influenced by French résider or Latin residere 'remain', from re- 'back' + sedere 'sit'"
Source: Oxford British English dictionary
Clearly the same sense of "to occupy".
--------------------------------------------------
Note added at 21 horas (2013-03-25 16:51:32 GMT)
--------------------------------------------------
Some uses of to reside:
The headquarters
"Neale Attenborough took over as CEO from Emrick after the sale. The Hillsboro label center was shut in 2007 with those crusades consolidated with a sister company's processes in Pennsylvania, while the headquarters RESIDED in Hillsboro with 150 employees."
http://www.amazines.com/Business/article_detail.cfm/3046887?...
Perfumes
"Marni is one of a few new perfumes to graduate from my workroom to my bedroom mantelpiece, where my personal-use scents RESIDE. Here are the others."
http://www.guardian.co.uk/fashion/2013/mar/23/sali-hughes-ne...
The newness
"This, though, is a crude summary of a wispy, shape-shifting book, for there are other worlds at play. The name Novilla captures the mixture of newness and nowhere that RESIDES in literary utopias from Thomas More onwards."
http://www.ft.com/intl/cms/s/2/151395ea-84e4-11e2-891d-00144...
Public spending:
"Apprenticeships are partly funded by a tax on corporations and while companies can channel part of their contribution to the schools they want to support, the bulk of the public spending allocation power RESIDES with local governments."
http://www.ft.com/cms/s/2/c575b508-6581-11e2-a3db-00144feab4...
Data:
"The business needs to be able to prevent the loss of data that may come to RESIDE on those devices."
http://www.guardian.co.uk/media-network/media-network-blog/2...
A trophy:
"Chelsea fans may forgive Roman Abramovich anything for as long as the Champions League trophy RESIDES at Stamford Bridge. "
http://www.guardian.co.uk/football/blog/2013/feb/28/rafael-b...
A statue:
"Where Should Statue Of Barnum RESIDE?"
http://www.nytimes.com/1993/12/26/nyregion/l-where-should-st...
Peer comment(s):
| neutral |
Sheila Wilson
: people reside, not apartments // I don't find anything in your ref. to call into question my knowledge of the language. You simply cannot say that an apartment resides in a building.
11 hrs
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Sorry, Sheila, but you are wrong in that:http://oxforddictionaries.com/us/definition/american_english... You were wrong as Oxford says that there are other meanings of "to reside" related to objects, feelings. On personification: read below
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| disagree |
Emma Paulay
: Sheila is right. This term is incorrect.//You can give all the dictionary refs you like - and I agree that in the instances you quote, the term works (due to personification in most cases). It doesn't work here. Sometimes only a native ear will do.
12 hrs
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Sorry Emma, nobody can be located but a building can: http://oxforddictionaries.com/us/definition/american_english...
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| disagree |
Jane Proctor (X)
: objects don't reside; people reside. Thank you for the ref. In your link the painting is being personified. It's a rare usage and not one that works here.
13 hrs
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Objects? See what Oxford says about resides: http://oxforddictionaries.com/us/definition/american_english... The paintings as well as the units, qualities inheritaded. Clear personification here: the reason to use "prendre place" in French.
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| disagree |
AllegroTrans
: this sounds completely unnatural applied to a building and this particular text
1 day 21 hrs
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Your comment came a bit later once the question is closed. But I still don't agree as all the samples above support my opinion. Maybe it is a matter of style corresponding to the "unnatural" French style. Have you thought about that?
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Discussion