Nov 17, 2018 14:30
5 yrs ago
136 viewers *
French term
comité social et économique
French to English
Bus/Financial
Management
UK English
"Le comité social et économique (CSE) est une importante innovation des ordonnances Macron destiné à nous rapprocher des standards européens en matière de gouvernance sociale dans l’entreprise. Le CSE fusionne, à droit constant, les attributions des actuelles instances représentatives du personnel, délégués du personnel (DP), comité d'entreprise (CE) et comité d'hygiène, de sécurité et des conditions de travail (CHSCT) par la création d’une nouvelle instance."
https://www2.deloitte.com/fr/fr/pages/talents-et-ressources-...
https://www2.deloitte.com/fr/fr/pages/talents-et-ressources-...
Proposed translations
(English)
| 4 +3 | social and economic committee |
Francois Boye
|
| 3 | industrial and economic council |
Mpoma
|
Proposed translations
+3
9 hrs
Francois Boye
United States
United States
Native in French
United States
An economic geek with social skills
Native in: French 
Works in: English to French, French to English, Spanish to English, and 1 more.
Related KudoZ points
:
12
Selected
social and economic committee
Peer comment(s):
| agree |
ph-b (X)
: Pourquoi pas ?
9 hrs
|
| agree |
Eliza Hall
: Yes. Particularly since this seems to be the standard translation in the UK media, so using it would enable readers to google it and bring up those media references, for better understanding.
17 hrs
|
| agree |
Mpoma
: I agree for the reasons given by Eliza... but in fact I think "social" in this context is not right in EN. It can also translate as "industrial" or here "employee-related", "employee" or "personnel"
498 days
|
4 KudoZ points awarded for this answer.
Comment: "Thanks François. I have also found https://www.actanceavocats.com/actualites/actualite-legislative-ou-reglementaire/key-changes-in-french-labor-rules-27 "
829 days
industrial and economic council
I've changed my mind about the accepted answer. Social here is used, in my view, with the meaning of "relating to the employees' life within the company". This is explicit in the definition given in the ST. This is clearly a replacement, as stated in the definition, above all of the comité d'entpreprise, "works council". Hence I think keep the word "council".
The main mystery, to my way of thinking, is what the word économique is doing there. No explanation is given about this in, for example, the article in François' link.
I was inclined to say "employees' economic council", but that sounds too forced, to me. I think "industrial" has enough connotation of "being about the workers", e.g. expressions such as "industrial tribunal".
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Note added at 829 days (2021-02-24 09:02:20 GMT) Post-grading
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Unfortunately, however, the accepted answer seems to have gained ground by now (2021), so probably better to use that, although I think it's not right: the English word "social" doesn't belong here at all, to my way of thinking.
The main mystery, to my way of thinking, is what the word économique is doing there. No explanation is given about this in, for example, the article in François' link.
I was inclined to say "employees' economic council", but that sounds too forced, to me. I think "industrial" has enough connotation of "being about the workers", e.g. expressions such as "industrial tribunal".
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Note added at 829 days (2021-02-24 09:02:20 GMT) Post-grading
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Unfortunately, however, the accepted answer seems to have gained ground by now (2021), so probably better to use that, although I think it's not right: the English word "social" doesn't belong here at all, to my way of thinking.
Note from asker:
| I agree that the use of the word "social" here in English is problematic as it does evoke works outings or boozy parties. The word, in French, tends to refer to labour relations or "the two sides of industry". There's the use of the term in the context of a "plan social" (a legal requirement of a company with at least 50 employees intending to create at least 10 redundancies within 30 days), where it could be translated as "social responsibility". However, I don't think your suggestion of "industrial and economic council" works. I think that the nearest equivalent in British English is a Joint Consultative Committee https://dictionary.cambridge.org/dictionary/english/joint-consultative-committee . However, using that term as a translation could be misleading, as it would imply more equivalence than really exists. |
Discussion
Bearing in mind that the idea is for trade union delegates and staff representatives to be able to keep an eye on bosses, if I was asked to translate this for the first time, I'd lean towards "finance" over "economics".
The question though is whether to use "finances" or "finance" or "financial"
I think "social" can perhaps cause an error as if you interpret it as "society" at large, then the more general "economics" seems to fit better with it. But for me, social is the "works committee" who have their noses in the company's books (finances)
Regards