Glossary entry (derived from question below)
English term or phrase:
fat-things-overboard
Dutch translation:
ballast overboord
Added to glossary by
Henk Peelen
May 22, 2006 21:39
17 yrs ago
English term
fat-things-overboard
English to Dutch
Other
Linguistics
Hallo,
I am translating from English to Greek, and I have a question regarding the following paragraph:
Lengthy clauses are avoided in natural language use. Long constituents tend to be placed outside the clause. In Dutsch prescriptive stylistics, this is known as the *'fat-things-overboard'* principle.
Would anyone know if the term 'fat-things-overboard' exists as such in Dutch? Or if there is some other term for the principle mentioned in the text?
Many thanks
I am translating from English to Greek, and I have a question regarding the following paragraph:
Lengthy clauses are avoided in natural language use. Long constituents tend to be placed outside the clause. In Dutsch prescriptive stylistics, this is known as the *'fat-things-overboard'* principle.
Would anyone know if the term 'fat-things-overboard' exists as such in Dutch? Or if there is some other term for the principle mentioned in the text?
Many thanks
Proposed translations
(Dutch)
| 3 | ballast overboord |
Henk Peelen
|
| 3 +3 | houdt het simpel |
11thmuse
|
| 3 | (overtollig) vet wegsnijden |
Harry Borsje
|
| 2 +1 | doe maar gewoon, dan doe je al gek genoeg |
Jan Willem van Dormolen (X)
|
| 3 | recht-toe-recht-aan |
Henk Peelen
|
Proposed translations
12 hrs
Henk Peelen
Netherlands
Netherlands
Native in Dutch
Netherlands
Polytechnic school; Studio & memoQ
Native in: Dutch 
Works in: German to Dutch, English to Dutch
Related KudoZ points
:
11
Selected
ballast overboord
I can't find evidence that htis saying really exists in grammar context, but it would be a translation with the same meaning (litterally ballast overboard).
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Note added at 14 hrs (2006-05-23 12:24:45 GMT)
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en slechts een handvol formules geeft 'die zo spoedig mogelijk, dikwijls nog eerder dan het Grieks en Latijn, als ballast overboord ge- worpen worden'.
means
and only a mere handfull of formulas 'which are thrown overboard as ballast, often yet sooner than Greek or Latin'.
It doens't really help us
--------------------------------------------------
Note added at 14 hrs (2006-05-23 12:24:45 GMT)
--------------------------------------------------
en slechts een handvol formules geeft 'die zo spoedig mogelijk, dikwijls nog eerder dan het Grieks en Latijn, als ballast overboord ge- worpen worden'.
means
and only a mere handfull of formulas 'which are thrown overboard as ballast, often yet sooner than Greek or Latin'.
It doens't really help us
Note from asker:
| Hallo, Henk, I have just found this en slechts een handvol formules geeft 'die zo spoedig mogelijk, dikwijls nog eerder dan het Grieks en Latijn, als ballast overboord ge- worpen worden'. ... but as you can imagine I can hardly understand what this means! Seeing that it refers to Greek and Latin, I can only presume that it has to do with linguistics - no? |
| It talks about formulas, so I guess it has to do with language structure. Still, it doesn't seem to be about a principle as such, but just a metaphor. Thanks, anyway, this is of great help. |
4 KudoZ points awarded for this answer.
Comment: "many thanks to all of you for your help :-)"
+3
8 hrs
houdt het simpel
dit zou kunnen,denk ik. Keep it lean. Keep is simple.
Note from asker:
| Hallo, Henk, I am afraid I cannot get the meaning of 'dit zou kunnen, denk ik' - can only make wild guesses. Could you please give that in English? many thanks, Katerina |
Peer comment(s):
| agree |
Maleen Hof
: I can't find any references, but this is what it means
11 mins
|
| agree |
Henk Peelen
: Im perative mood? Without the t: Houd het simpel or Houdt u het simpel
1 hr
|
| agree |
Jack den Haan
: Houd het simpel. PS: "dit zou kunnen,denk ik" = I think this would be a possibility.
2 hrs
|
8 hrs
Harry Borsje
Netherlands
Netherlands
Native in Dutch
Netherlands
Communicate technology with passion
Native in: Dutch
Works in: German to Dutch, English to Dutch
Related KudoZ points
:
4
(overtollig) vet wegsnijden
This is the closest one I can think of - to cut away (excess) fat. It *is* a traditional saying, although in modern language it definitely reaks of liposuction etc.. But what's the difference, right?
+1
8 hrs
doe maar gewoon, dan doe je al gek genoeg
The only really *Dutch* expression that comes close is this one, which roughly translates as "act normally, and you'll be acting strange enough". However, that doesn't even remotely resemble the English expression you mentioned.
I wonder if the source text might be mistaken and 'Deutsch' (German) is meant in stead of 'Dutch'? (especially since the word is spelled wrongly) It's a reasonably common confusion among English speakers. You might want to ask this question to the German speakers too.
I wonder if the source text might be mistaken and 'Deutsch' (German) is meant in stead of 'Dutch'? (especially since the word is spelled wrongly) It's a reasonably common confusion among English speakers. You might want to ask this question to the German speakers too.
Note from asker:
| Hallo Jan, well, I am afraid the mistake in the spelling is mine :-( |
10 hrs
Henk Peelen
Netherlands
Netherlands
Native in Dutch
Netherlands
Polytechnic school; Studio & memoQ
Native in: Dutch
Works in: German to Dutch, English to Dutch
Related KudoZ points
:
11
recht-toe-recht-aan
is the most sppropriate translation in my opinion. Litterally translation would be something like
straight-to(wards)-straight-on
dit staat bekend als het *'recht-toe-recht-aan'*-principe.
http://www.itcommercie.nl/site.php/6/mobile/Stijlvolle_recht...
De fraai vormgegeven Palm TX is de opvolger van de Tungsten en biedt de beste prijs/kwaliteit- verhouding voor wie op zoek is naar een recht-toe-recht-aan-PDA
straight-to(wards)-straight-on
dit staat bekend als het *'recht-toe-recht-aan'*-principe.
http://www.itcommercie.nl/site.php/6/mobile/Stijlvolle_recht...
De fraai vormgegeven Palm TX is de opvolger van de Tungsten en biedt de beste prijs/kwaliteit- verhouding voor wie op zoek is naar een recht-toe-recht-aan-PDA
Discussion
The very length of this clause has here caused a deviation from the normal rule of word order: Topic - Setting - Predicate - Focus. If this is indeed a rule in Greek word order, it would be identical to the *'fat-things-overboard'* principle in Dutch prescriptive linguistics. (I am told by my undergraduates that this is originally a strategy used in algebra).
My question is, could it be that this is a principle of Dutch grammar, for which there is some other term in Dutch - and not an expression like 'fat-things-overboard'?