Apr 14, 2008 19:54
16 yrs ago
2 viewers *
Spanish term
United States
servicios para autores académicos
Native in: English
Works in: Spanish to English, English
gente (contrasted to pueblo)
Spanish to English
Social Sciences
Government / Politics
Mexico
Okay, KudoZing Prozers! Have I got a question for you... (but do please read my explanation that follows):
I'm translating a text in which the author makes the argument that in the political arena, there is a subtle but real distinction between referring to "el pueblo" (which we are translating as "the people," as in "We, the People..." in the preamble to the U.S. Constitution) and referring to "la gente."
Our conundrum is how to translate "gente".
One of the key points is that "gente" conveys the notion of separated/isolated individuals, just anybody, but not somebody who is connected to other members of the polity.
In choosing to use "gente," one is turning one's back on civil society and popular self-determination of organized groups.
I'd be grateful for any ideas (one word) that would express that and which could be used consistently wherever "gente" appears in the text.
TIA!
I'm translating a text in which the author makes the argument that in the political arena, there is a subtle but real distinction between referring to "el pueblo" (which we are translating as "the people," as in "We, the People..." in the preamble to the U.S. Constitution) and referring to "la gente."
Our conundrum is how to translate "gente".
One of the key points is that "gente" conveys the notion of separated/isolated individuals, just anybody, but not somebody who is connected to other members of the polity.
In choosing to use "gente," one is turning one's back on civil society and popular self-determination of organized groups.
I'd be grateful for any ideas (one word) that would express that and which could be used consistently wherever "gente" appears in the text.
TIA!
Proposed translations
(English)
Proposed translations
+2
4 hrs
Jessica Noyes
United States
United States
Native in English
Works in field
United States
Expect excellent English
Native in: English (Variants: US, Canadian) 
Works in: Spanish to English, French to English, English
Related KudoZ points
:
16
Selected
people (contrasted to "the people")
The use or not of the article is the key here.
However, to sustain this difference throughout a whole book you'd need to italicize one or the other.
However, to sustain this difference throughout a whole book you'd need to italicize one or the other.
Note from asker:
| thank you--that's a very good solution! |
Peer comment(s):
| agree |
neilmac
: (Song) .. are the luckiest people .. in the world :) A good solution IMO
8 hrs
|
| agree |
Deborah Workman
: I didn't see yours when I submitted mine.
19 hrs
|
4 KudoZ points awarded for this answer.
Comment: "Everyone's ideas were helpful, but this seems like a good solution (very parsimonious). Thank you!"
+6
1 min
persons / individuals
as opposed to people..
Note from asker:
| Thank you for this very good suggestion! |
Peer comment(s):
| agree |
mariana24
34 mins
|
| agree |
Lorena Vicente
46 mins
|
| agree |
Yamila Sosa
57 mins
|
| agree |
Edward Tully
1 hr
|
| agree |
mar52
: I would go with individuals.
6 hrs
|
| agree |
claudia mestre
6 hrs
|
1 min
AllegroTrans
United Kingdom
United Kingdom
Native in English
Works in field
United Kingdom
Sensible solutions
Native in: English (Variant: Wessexois)
Works in: French to English, English, English to French
Related KudoZ points
:
123
the élite/the privileged/the favored
suggestion
+3
5 mins
Cesar Serrano
United States
United States
Native in Spanish
&
English
Works in field
United States
AUTOMOTIVE -MEDICAL -CONTRACTS -OIL&GAS
Native in: English (Variant: US) , Spanish (Variant: Latin American)
Works in: Spanish to English, English to Spanish, English, and 9 more.
Related KudoZ points
:
16
the citizens (although is has a connotation of individuals belonging to "the masses")
the citizens (although is has a connotation of individuals belonging to "the masses")
Peer comment(s):
| agree |
Marina Soldati
: Hablando de populismo no creo que se pueda hablar de ciudadanos, me inclino por "masses"
33 mins
|
|
Muchas gracias, Marina! Saludos!
|
|
| agree |
Diane Kenyon
: agree with "the masses", contrasting "people power" with easy to manipulate masses
1 hr
|
|
Thank you Dekken!
|
|
| agree |
Belli
: "the masses"
13 hrs
|
|
Thanks Belli!
|
2 hrs
Cynthia Herber, LL.M.
United States
United States
Native in Spanish
Specializes in field
United States
Legal, Corporate, International Trade
Native in: Spanish
Works in: English to Spanish, Spanish to English
Related KudoZ points
:
4
people/nation
El término gente se utiliza cuando se refiere a un grupo de personas (a group of people) y el término pueblo puede ser equiparado con Nationpues se refiere a personas de una misma sociedad que comparten ideas, historia y metas. Por ejemplo, si se utiliza el término que alguien sugirió como We, the People, la conotación es que se trata de A PEOPLE, as in The American People (la nación Americana). La distinicion es muy sutil pero como en Español ambas opciones (gente y puebo) se traducen al ingles como people, yo sugiero esta distinción. Si se trata de un término económico como "working people" entonces se facilita un poco pues se traduce como la "clase trabajadora".
Una sugerencia.
Una sugerencia.
Note from asker:
| Cynthia: Muchas gracias por tus observaciones que me parecen muy útiles... |
7 hrs
folks
substitution of “the people” by “just folks” / “everyman”
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Note added at 8 horas (2008-04-15 03:59:22 GMT)
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En el contexto de agencias y programas sociales, en EEUU se refieren a “clients” o “beneficiaries”.
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Note added at 8 horas (2008-04-15 03:59:22 GMT)
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En el contexto de agencias y programas sociales, en EEUU se refieren a “clients” o “beneficiaries”.
Note from asker:
| Sandra: Mi duda (ojala que puedo explicarla bien) es que "gente" en español implica históricamente "gente de razón" no es cierto? Y el pueblo ha sido siempre "el populacho". Ahora con Bush, se oye un presidente diciendo "folks" pero crees que Fox o Zedillo o Calderón al decir "gente" tiene en mente la figura de "folks"? Se me hace muy informal ... Gracias!! |
19 hrs
Sylvia Valls
Native in Spanish
&
English
Specializes in field
PhD Mod Langs and Lits Fr. Eng-Sp nativ
Native in: English 
, Spanish
Works in: French to English, French to Spanish, Spanish to English, and 1 more.
Related KudoZ points
:
8
people in general
Considering all the erudite efforts already spent here I dare venture "people in general" or "population" so far not considered. Gente also refers to the "troopers"... amies following a leader. So the subtleties indeed are practically insoluble. Hope this additional option proves useful.
+1
7 hrs
Deborah Workman
United States
United States
Native in English
Works in field
United States
Telecom/new media tech, law, bus, mktg
Native in: English
Works in: Spanish to English, Portuguese to English, French to English, and 1 more.
Related KudoZ points
:
8
people (contrasted to the people) OR the public (contrasted to the people)
One approach is to read that what your author is saying is that "what people say" is equated with "what the people want".
Another is to read that your author is repeating the distinction made between "the public" and "the people". <http://www.google.com/search?hl=en&q="the public and the peo... As I understand this distinction, the people are the masses of our society -- many of them uninformed -- whereas the public are the informed groups participating in society (or groups with information or misinformation but nevertheless participating in society).
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Note added at 23 hrs (2008-04-15 19:46:37 GMT)
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Your problem is solved by saying "people" (folks) in contrast to "the people" (the populous of the nation).
Another is to read that your author is repeating the distinction made between "the public" and "the people". <http://www.google.com/search?hl=en&q="the public and the peo... As I understand this distinction, the people are the masses of our society -- many of them uninformed -- whereas the public are the informed groups participating in society (or groups with information or misinformation but nevertheless participating in society).
--------------------------------------------------
Note added at 23 hrs (2008-04-15 19:46:37 GMT)
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Your problem is solved by saying "people" (folks) in contrast to "the people" (the populous of the nation).
+1
3 hrs
the mass or the herd
The article is referring to the similarity of the way in which both neoliberals and populists consider the general public
The sentence translates as , in my muble opinion
"The most dangerous trait of both the neoliberals and the populists has been the sustitution of the people for " the mass" or "the herd.
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Note added at 1 day2 hrs (2008-04-15 22:05:43 GMT)
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This is being said by someone who wishes to draw attention to the fact that he is different from the Populists or neoliberals and the way in which he views the populace - the neoliberals and populists have only contempt for the masses.
The sentence translates as , in my muble opinion
"The most dangerous trait of both the neoliberals and the populists has been the sustitution of the people for " the mass" or "the herd.
--------------------------------------------------
Note added at 1 day2 hrs (2008-04-15 22:05:43 GMT)
--------------------------------------------------
This is being said by someone who wishes to draw attention to the fact that he is different from the Populists or neoliberals and the way in which he views the populace - the neoliberals and populists have only contempt for the masses.
Peer comment(s):
| agree |
neilmac
: the lumpen ... quite hard to express without falling on one side of the fence...
10 hrs
|
1 day 12 hrs
members of society
I thought about this more and this occurred to me. It's not as short as you'd probably like but it really it the way it would be expressed in English.
Feb 5, 2008 ... Doctors ARE valuable members of society! You can hear it the way they say provi-i-i-i-ders. You can sense it in the tone of their rhetoric. ...
theindependenturologist.blogspot.com/2008/02/doc... - 71k - Similar pages
http://theindependenturologist.blogspot.com/2008/02/doctors-...
# Productive Members of Society (recovery oriented) - What doe...
What does PMS stand for? Definition of Productive Members of Society (recovery oriented) in the list of acronyms and abbreviations provided by the
Feb 5, 2008 ... Doctors ARE valuable members of society! You can hear it the way they say provi-i-i-i-ders. You can sense it in the tone of their rhetoric. ...
theindependenturologist.blogspot.com/2008/02/doc... - 71k - Similar pages
http://theindependenturologist.blogspot.com/2008/02/doctors-...
# Productive Members of Society (recovery oriented) - What doe...
What does PMS stand for? Definition of Productive Members of Society (recovery oriented) in the list of acronyms and abbreviations provided by the
Discussion
“mi gente” es cariñoso, en algunos usos, hasta patriótico. Lo mismo “mi pueblo” y “el pueblo”, que también se usa en el contecto político-jurídico, como en “We the people”.
El neoliberalismo colocó al individuo aislado dentro del mercado; el populismo colocó al ciudadano como menor de edad, dependiente del Estado: uno y otro agruparon a los individuos como “la gente”.
El rasgo social más gravoso de los neoliberales y los populistas ha sido la sustitución del “pueblo” por la “gente”.